We just had a cadre of students who have been accepted to our graduate program visit our department; it's a way for us to try to recruit them, and a way for them to try to decide where to go for graduate school. The power relations are unusual: the visitors are treated like royalty, and, moreover, the offer of admission has already been extended, so there's no way to screw that up. However, there are many ways one can make a bad impression on these visits. To wit:
1. Do not tell the chair of the department right off the bat that you've come just for the free trip and food. (A student in recent memory did this, but wound up accepting our offer in the end... That was fun.)
2. Do not say a faculty member anything resembling the following, "You work [in area x]? Why? Don't you know that philosohy has moved beyond that?"
3. Do not say to a faculty member, "I read your book on [x]. It was good introductory material."
4. Do not say to the Director of Graduate Studies anything resembling the following, "I'll never take any courses with you, and have no interest in [your area of research], so is there any way we can arrange for someone else to be my DGS?" (I heard this one third-hand; on only a highly charitable interpretation was the student mistaken about what a DGS is....)
5. Do not boast over dinner that you have "already written" your dissertation, and are simply "going through the motions" until it's time to submit it.
It should be emphasized that once you accept an offer and enter a program, the power shifts back to its more usual dynamic, to the great advantage of the faculty. When goodies are being doled out, or when special opportunities arise, the ones who made a bad impression are often off the radar.
Good luck to all in choosing a program.
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28 comments:
This year, I'm my department's grad student in charge of organizing the prospective student visits. Thanks for letting me know what to expect...jerk.
Don't wear a wife beater and shorts, even if the school is in warmer climates.
An admit to my department this year has managed to make himself universally hated by making a bunch of sexist comments, as well as gross physical comments about one of the current grad students.
"An admit to my department this year has managed to make himself universally hated by making a bunch of sexist comments, as well as gross physical comments about one of the current grad students."
Fantastic. He'll get in somewhere really good and if I'm lucky, that asshole someday will be my boss.
Do remember that the people you're visiting may very well be either (i) writing you reference letters or (ii) looking at your job application when it's time to go on the market. Bad impressions last. Start acting accordingly now.
I agree these are bad, but the following variation on 2 is fine:
"You work [in area x]? Why? Don't you know that [area x] is even more worthless than dog poop?"
After all, philosophy moving on from one thing to another is not a good indicator of the worth of either.
DON'T walk through a screen door during a party at the department chair's house.
DO fix any screen doors you happen to walk through during departmental events.
NOTE: strictly speaking this occurred not during a student visit but during my ... er um ... the student's first week in the program.
6. Don't tell the current grad students that you are surprised that ours is the best program you got into. That's the case for all of us...
Don't put up with sexual harassment from sleazy older faculty.
Do get drunk enough to show the other grad students you are fun.
Do make active use of stimulants so you don't conk out after a long day of visiting, because that's when the grad students can really show you the city.
Don't fondle the girl grad students, unless you are explicitly invited to do so.
Do take active advantage of the trip to investigate local back up plans in case you get a clue and and drop out of grad school when you realize that you can work a 9-5 job and actually have grown-folks-fun living in this place, or in case you meet, fall in love with, and reproduce with a local. In other words, consider this might be your permanent home.
Don't take life too seriously, Don't take work seriously at all.
Is it ok to smoke pot if I bring enough for everyone?
Don't get pissed at someone who asks you if you're pregnant when you're not because he's an idiot that you'll just have to get used to working with.
In my experience from both sides, the single most important rule is this:
Keep your ego in check.
That is, I'm sure that it is the case that:
1) You are smart.
2) You have lots of philosophical promise.
3) We really want you to come to our program and we know that others really want you to come to their programs too.
However, I'm also pretty sure that it is also the case that:
1) You are not the smartest prospect we've ever seen (let alone the smartest prospect this year). Also, clearly being a program's smartest prospect strongly suggests that the program is mediocre if not outright lousy.
2) The philosophical claims you boldly (or if not also drunkenly) espouse and the manner in which you so vigorously defend them are unoriginal and neither sophisticated nor nuanced--your present philosophical ability will almost certainly belie any arrogance on your part.
3) Though we may initially want you, we also think you are fungible; the difference between you and those folks on the waitlist is negligible. Moreover, we have on occasion changed our minds about prospectives after a visit, and have been known to actively (or at least passively) encourage such prospects to go elsewhere--we have even in rare cases discussed offer rescindment.
To all prospectives: Congrats! Way to go!
Just remember that in 5-7 years that, when you look back on your prospective self, thinking you weren't then a dumbass (or a douche) strongly suggests being and having remained a dumbass (or a douche).
@Anon March 16, 2010 9:28 PM:
I know of someone who got an offer at a very highly ranked department rescinded by doing exactly that, and ended up going somewhere a good 20 spots lower as a result.
That's worth keeping in mind - though the point about the usual power relations being backwards on those trips is usually true, act like a big enough dick and the normal relations can and will reassert themselves.
Apropos of the deference shown visiting prospective students, an old joke.
Once a student bent on graduate school had her life cut short by a car accident. Her soul went to heaven, where St. Peter welcomed her. He asked her to wait just inside the gates for a moment while he made some arrangements. So she spent some time stretched out on the comfy clouds, playing her harp. She thought to herself that she would thoroughly enjoy heaven. However, it seems students have a unique protocol: Each has to have a day in hell before choosing where to stay permanently.
Although the student was convinced she would stay in heaven, she dutifully complied and went to hell for a visit. When she arrived, much to her surprise, she discovered a lush, verdant and beautiful world filled with many fellow students all decked out in gorgeous attire. They all rushed to embrace her, to talk about their interests and reminisce about the days when they were all alive.
That evening, they all ate the very best food. The night was filled with wine, song, dance and conversation. She met a man who referred to himself as 'Satan' but he was so charming that she had a hard time believing this was the prince of darkness himself. Indeed, the whole experience was so enjoyable that it was a surprise to find that it was already time for her to leave. They all said their goodbyes and she travelled back to heaven as she got on the elevator.
"Now you must choose where to stay forever.” St. Peter said. She replied without much hesitation, "Heaven is fine, but Hell sure seems like a whole lot more fun." So St. Peter sent her back to Hell.
When she arrived she found herself in a foul dump, knee-deep in filth. She saw the other students she with whom had had such a great time, looking forlorn and depressed, sorting through the filth. Then, the man who had called himself ‘Satan’ arrived, still smiling. "What’s going on?” she asked, " I was just here yesterday and this was a beautiful paradise with food, fun and great conversation. Now it’s just a pile of filth and everyone looks so terribly depressed.”
Satan smiled. "Yesterday we were recruiting you. Now, you’re one of us.”
Anonymous @ March 18 12:38 AM
I am printing this out and folding it up and sneaking into our visiting students materials. This is the best!
Here's one Don'ts for the faculty:
DON'T lie and/or evade questions about the famous and awesome faculty member who is officially part of the department, and advertised as such, but due to departmental in-fighting hasn't been around for a couple of years and as everyone in the dept knows plans never to return.
Am I the only one who's in a department (mostly) full of collegial professionals, with grad students who (mostly) conduct themselves like adults who understand social interaction, or are the students outliers?
Then again, as stated before, I know Spiros' institution. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that the grad students in his department are a tad... bizarre. It's a perfectly good school, but I think it's safe to say that many of the students, grad and undergrad, imagined themselves... going to some other institutions. In my experience, they compensate for not getting their pipe-dreams by being pretentious.
Verification: phongslo
Do take what the grad students say (and do, including the type and quality of the work they have produced) very seriously.
Don't take what the faculty say very seriously.
Do realize you're much less educated than the grad students, even if you might be smarter. So don't be a douche about your 'research.'
Here you all are talking about this meaningless nonsense, while in the meantime Alex Chilton has a posse... That's the only thing anyone should be talking or thinking about this evening.
DO do the grad students a big favor:
DON'T ask them what they're working on.
DON'T answer when they or other prospectives ask you what area of philosophy you're interested in (they only ask either as a formality or for lack of a better question).
DO tell them you like philosophy but would rather not go into that right then, and gently steer the conversation to something else (if it has to be philosophy-related, you can ask them about which professors they've taken classes with and what they were like, or other non-work-related questions).
I'm amazed by all the stories of dickish prospective behavior. I've never encountered anything like this either as a grad student or a prospective.
A different sort of advice: As a prospective, I was convinced that I'd been accepted to all the schools I was visiting by some sort of massive fluke (delusional letter writers, a writing sample that somehow made me look better than I really was). I tried to avoid faculty members at visits because I was terrified that they'd realize I was a moron, when people asked me about my work, I basically told them that I didn't know anything and tried to change the subject. When other prospectives talked about their own work, I thought they must know vastly more about everything than me because they knew about things I didn't know about.
DON'T do that. You all know about your own little niches. People talk about what they know about. The fact that you don't know about their research doesn't say anything about their potential or yours. It is outrageously unlikely that you were accepted (especially at multiple schools) by a fluke. And you won't get nearly as much out of visits (or make as good an impression) if you're scared of everyone and feeling inadequate.
Relax. Go with the assumption that you're an average admit for the school your at. Be aware of the fact that some people may be more confident than you (and hence coming off as more impressive) or less confident (and hence not letting their potential shine through). Don't take anything anyone says at prospective visits as evidence of their/your philosophical potential.
I'm going to second Anon 12:52 PM's comment. There seems to me to be issues of over-confidence/hubris/doucheness as well as the notorious Impostor Syndrome to guard against. When doing campus visits and adjusting through the first year or so of graduate programs, it's very hard to perceive the marathon nature of the process. Fellow students that initially come off as incredibly impressive may not go the distance. Quiet, diligent students one hardly ever sees, may come through brilliantly. Of course, sometimes some loudly impressive students, even some of the douchey ones, do come up with the goods and some reticent students disappear along the way. It's just impossible to tell in the short run who will make the distance. There's a hell of a lot of talk. Try not to get too caught up in it--including the stuff you'll hear yourself say.
How sad is 11.56pm! Most philosophers like talking about their own and others work. Are you sure you are cut out to be a philosopher? Sounds like you view it as a job - and like most office workers, you don't want to talk about your job when you are out of the office.
Dan:
(a) I'm definitely not cut out to be a professional philosopher and I don't plan to.
(b) There's nothing sad about that from my perspective.
(c) Even grad students that like talking about their work don't usually enjoy having to answer the same question in detail 5-10 times in a few days (unless they've got ego issues and think they're impressing the prospectives). So it's still doing them a favor to reduce that number by one.
At least that's my take on it.
Don't let on to your professors that their world is even more self serving and solipsistic than yours.
Do remember that small minds are the largest thing in their universe.
Do remember that chickens will circle a bleeding isolated chicken and peck it to death.
Anonymous 1:14
Without trying to sound insulting, it's clear you aren't cut out to be a philosopher because you have the bizarre idea that professional philosophers DON'T want to talk about what they do.
Trust me. This is why they are who they are. Academia, and especially philosophy, is a lifestyle, not a job. Get professional philosophers together, and not only do they WANT to talk about what they're working on, you can't STOP them from doing so. Every party, every function, every social event where they gather in any number, and the conversation turns to philosophy. This is why they are who they are.
You can't understand it unless you live it.
Anon 3/22 11:33 am. Without being insulting or anything, I feel really genuinely bad for you and anyone else (which admittedly are most of the philosophers I know) who lives life in the way you describe. It sounds like such people have only one interest and can only interact and bond with one kind of person.
I happen to think I am really a philosopher, so much so that I have not one but two full-time philosophy gigs. Most of my closest friends are philosophers.
And, yeah, we talk about work sometimes. But usually if one of my philosophy friends and I want to talk about philosophy, we will have have a conversation about what we are talking about specifically. But for the most part we talk about other stuff -- television, movies, gossip, our pasts, personal lives, and god knows what else. Sometimes we talk about art, literature, fashion, or news. I may be in the minority -- I think its probably true that the majority people who do philosophy for a living almost never have talk about anything else -- but I am grateful for it every single day. I have great philosopher-friends. I also have great non-philosopher-friends on account of my ability to normally interact with people. I have a well-rounded social life due to having a well-rounded set of interests and desires in life. And I don't think it means I'm not cut out to be a professional philosopher; in fact, I think it is precisely what landed me a TT job in the first place. (Snuck a peak at my HR file once... the comment "Limited teaching experience but extraordinary interpersonal skills" jumped off the page of notes from my interview.) And I happen to think it is what makes me such a well-evaluated and well-liked teacher.
And I happen to think people -- especially those who visit our department as speakers or prospective grad students, but also my colleagues -- are actually intensely grateful for this. What Anon 3/18 11:56 says makes sense to me. I feel the question, "So what are your research interests?" is an update of the old college bar line "What's your major?" Develop some conversational skills. Talk about something interesting or engaging. Tell a fascinating story. Initiate a conversation in such a way that doesn't sound like a fucking job interview.
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